I’m stumped

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I’m stumped
Original Poster: BLACK PANTA
Forum: Grappling & Jiu-Jitsu
Posted On: 15-12-2005, 18:44

Orginal Post: BLACK PANTA: I haven’t tried this, but it’s been heavy on my mind. I’ve been thinking about back mount escapes. My question is can you pull of Kimura as a back mount escape? If so, any pics or help would be appreciated. I’m playing it over and over in my mind and it seems do-able. I still think that I’m overlooking something though.

Post: Galaknore:

I think it might be possible. I think it would depend on whether or not the opponent has his hooks in. If he did I don’t think there would be anyway to grab his arm and pull yourself around to get the kimura. I will have to ask my instructor about this.>

Post: BLACK PANTA:

i’m gonna ask my instructor aswell, but I can’t wait….it’s buggin me for some reason.>

Post: Galaknore:

This is the best part about grappling. I have been in shootfighting for two years, but I am still learning new things all of the time. This is actually really starting to bug me though. Because maybe you could some how role and then catch the guy in a kimura…>

Post: BLACK PANTA:

yeah man, i’m thinking like when he rolls on his back, you set up the kimura, while he’s controlling you with his arms. Then work from there, but you’re right, i can’t really see how to get passed the hooks. I’m gonna have to work on that on the mat. Is this an actual move tho?>

Post: Stg:

when you say back mount, do you mean when somebody has you in the turtle positition and pulls you back so he’s under you for a rnc or do you mean when you’re on the bottom of a mount and you give your opponent your back?>

Post: BLACK PANTA:

when you’re turtled and he’s goin for RNC, well just when he has your back really…>

Post: Tease T Tickle:

It’s basically a horizontal “switch” in wrestling vernacular. On a test subject, it could work if you knew how to move, but on a resisting opponent you’re more than likely going to get ridden or allowed to move into a mount/guard position rather than get the submission.>

Post: Stg:

yeah, i think that would lead into the guy’s guard. pass the guard and get the kimura :P>

Post: BLACK PANTA:

well I wasn’t really looking for the submission really. I generally use Kimura as a set up, more than a submission. But yeah Des I can see where you’re going with that. I really have to try that out this week.>

Post: Tease T Tickle:

It should be noted that against a skilled grappler, you will not get the top position by doing this. They will slip around you as you move, riding you back down. But hey, at least you don’t have to fear the RNC.>

Post: :

First, you cannot pull it off if someone has hooks in; just not gonna work.

If you’re going right arm:

You’re in a turtle position
Your opponet has his right arm either on your stomach, thigh, dangling, etc.
Catch the arm at the elbow using the crook of your arm as a hook.
This part is difficult to explain but would be easier to show, you want to sitout/do a switch/scoot your hips
From there either you can escape, or if they really suck you can get the submission.

I have a guy I roll with a lot that is always attacking with a kimura lock on my arm from all angles. He figure 4s the arm and keeps it no matter what position he’s in. Sometimes he gets the submission, sometimes not, regardless it’s a freaking nussiance that takes you away from your game.

With any technique, it’s just the basics working. If you know the regular kimura, try working the setup from all angles.>

Post: Tease T Tickle:

[quote=Fightauthority.com I have a guy I roll with a lot that is always attacking with a kimura lock on my arm from all angles. He figure 4s the arm and keeps it no matter what position he’s in. Sometimes he gets the submission, sometimes not, regardless it’s a freaking nussiance that takes you away from your game.[/quote 
That’s actually a VERY good strategy that I will sometime use. Not necessarily the constant kimura, but the constant dangerous lock. If you keep them working against your “submission” then they won’t really be able to stop you from gaining better positions, more secure locks, etc. Just the other day, I had one of my students in a cross choke from the front just to keep him from trying to transition out of my knee-on-belly position for long enough that I could full mount and work for the armbar.>

Post: BLACK PANTA:

was watching the Sak vs Renzo fight. It looks like Sak pulled off Kimura on Renzo, while Renzo had his back. It wasn’t a full back mount, but that gives me the impression that it can be done.>

Post: BLACK PANTA:

well I tried it and as Des predicted, it only worked to get in a better position. But it only worked ONCE.>

Post: samurai6string:

A-RISE chicken A-RISE!!!!
Long dead, now LIVE again!!!

anyway, I have your answer, High School State Champion wrestler to the rescue!!!
When the guy has hooks in, either one or two, what you are attempting to do is called an “arm drag.” This is even easier to do against someone wearing a gi than against someone in a singlet. :)

I’ll explain it for one hook then two.

With the arm that is being hooked, place your hand high on their arm, at about the deltoid, and grab the gi if applicable. Imagine that your hooked arm is like the eye of a needle, and his arm is like a piece of thread. Now what you want to do is pull his arm THROUGH the eye of the needle while you switch your hips, don’t do a full sitout as you want to have a minimal amount of space between you and your opponent, and swing your opposite arm HARD in the same direction.

If he has both hooks in, do as described above, but straighten out your opposite arm, and “swim” it out of the hook as you switch your hips.

What you have just done is pulled his body down into a space where your weight used to be, and is no longer supporting his. It is a little hard to explain in text, but it is really intuitive if you think about sliding his arm through yours. You should end up switching positions with you now mounted to his back. If you keep the arm you just “drug” (dragged?) you should be in a good position to either get a Key Lock or a Kimura.>

Post: Bushi:

I was going to write that this is a Sakuraba bread and butter move. He will actually give his back to try and get this move. The key is to secure it during the scramble before he sets his hooks.

It can be done.>

Post: BLACK PANTA:

what I’m working on is letting people get to my back and get their right hand into an armbar/lock, while they are trying to get the RNC in. Worked for me quite a number of times. I actually stumbled upon it while trying to pull off what I was asking in the opening thread lol.>

Post: TKDman:

[quote=BLACK PANTA was watching the Sak vs Renzo fight. It looks like Sak pulled off Kimura on Renzo, while Renzo had his back. It wasn’t a full back mount, but that gives me the impression that it can be done.[/quote 
Damn, this is exactly the fight I thought of when I say the title. That and the Sak vs Royce fight where Saku almost gets it. More like a rear bearhug while standing than the back mount, I’d think it’d be tough to pull it off without the mobility you have while standing.>

Post: Bushi:

Nick Diaz tries getting it too when he fights.>

Post: BLACK PANTA:

[quote=Bushi Nick Diaz tries getting it too when he fights.[/quote 

I get the feeling like this is a “call out” for nbotary lol..j/k. Hey isn’t Nick Diaz a purple belt?>

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